So You Got Arrested

Honor Student Charged in Death of Predator Counselor Part I

• BRCK Criminal Defense Attorneys

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The Texas justice system is often messy—so let's break it down. You're listening to So You Got Arrested, the podcast that tells you what really happens after an arrest.

In this explosive episode, hosted by BRCK Criminal Defense Attorneys, we discuss the case of John Alvarado, an 18-year-old honor student from Dimmit County, Texas, who was charged with murder after killing his high school migrant counselor, Dr. Carlos Pena, in April 2019.

John immediately told 911 he acted in self-defense after the much larger counselor attempted to sexually assault him. His claims of abuse and the use of cocaine were corroborated by police at the scene.

Join us as we dive into:

  • The alarming pattern of grooming used by the counselor on vulnerable students.
  • The overwhelming evidence, including hundreds of text messages, that showed John's resistance.
  • The final, fatal confrontation in a double-locked "man cave" that ended with John's desperate act of self-defense.

We examine how this good kid—a dedicated student, athlete, and triple-job worker—ended up charged with murder in the community he loved. We'll also hint at the shocking discovery that John was far from the only victim.

Tune in next week for part II

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SPEAKER_00:

You're listening to it, so you got arrested. A podcast that tells you what really happens after an arrest, hosted by British criminal defense attorneys. We talk to the people who have lived it, worked in it, and been safe by it. Whether you're facing charges or just want to understand your rights, your options, and the smart moves that could change everything, we've got your back.

SPEAKER_03:

So, Brian, um, last year you and I had a trial together in Dimmett County, Texas that had some interesting facts behind it. And it's a case that I wanted to discuss on the podcast today. Um, this incident uh involves uh an honor student who is charged in the murder of his high school counselor. And there's kind of a twist to the story, but this takes place in April of 2019. So if you would, could you kind of tell us a little bit uh about the case?

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah, so starts off with a 911 call made by our client, John Alvarado, who at the time, as you said, was an honor student. He was a senior in high school. Uh he was the caller to 911 saying that he was at a house in a small town called Asherton, which is right outside of uh uh Carizo Springs, where he went to high school.

SPEAKER_03:

And this is in Demick County, Texas.

SPEAKER_04:

Correct, yeah. And so he was basically calling out, he was frantic. Uh he basically had said that he had just killed his migrant counselor, uh man by the name of Dr. Carlos Pena. And uh he had basically told 911 that uh Dr. Pena had attempted to uh sexually assault him, and that he uh, John, had grabbed a knife, his knife, it was a folding pocket knife, and in self-defense had stabbed Carlos Pena a number of times. And uh basically he told that to 911 and police So when he calls 911, uh, is he still at the scene? He is. He was there, he was waiting, he was wearing a t-shirt. I think it was, if memory serves, uh this was back in 2019, he was wearing a t-shirt and he was wearing uh athletic shorts. And uh he had also told 911 that Dr. Pena had um made him clean, was having him clean, was giving him cocaine, was basically plying him with anything he could to basically try to have his way with John. Uh he was completely cooperative. And whenever police came on scene, and we have dash cams and uh body cams that later corroborate this, you know, he was cooperative when police got there and he was in the street and he was still uh, if memory serves, he was holding a phone and he was also holding the weapon that he'd used. Uh officers asked him to get down on the ground. He did so, cooperative. They put him in the back of a patrol car. And when he was back there, if memory serves, the sheriff at the time came back and also interviewed him a second time. And he had also said as much as well. But while there, uh the Demon County Sheriff's Office, they go into this house. And this house was, if you can imagine, it was a single-story structure, maybe one bathroom, three bedrooms, completely covered in trash and uh cigarettes. And whenever they make entry into the house, it was just an extremely messy environment. And what they found when they got into like the main living slash kitchen area was later who would be identified as Dr. Pena, lying face down on the ground. He had bled to death from multiple stab wounds uh to the throat and uh to the midsection. Uh, medics came in there, spent some time, but he was dead by that time. Uh, at one point in time, an uh immigration officer stopped and ran in. I mean, just completely against any decent procedure. While police are at the scene. While police were at the scene and still making entry. And while they were there, uh he was apparently the brother-in-law to Dr. Pena, and he was kind of making a to-do.

SPEAKER_03:

And and this Dr. Pena is a counselor at the high school that John attends.

SPEAKER_04:

Yes, he was uh at Carizo Springs, he had been there. He he was 50 years old at the time. Uh weight was uh 250 pounds, height was six foot five. Uh he was a big guy. Yeah, yeah, lived at the residence alone. And whenever uh police start investigating, not too far from his body, if you can imagine a table like the one we're sitting at, it was covered with cigarette ash, uh cocaine, which backed up what John had said on the on the um 911 call. Yes, and uh foils or what they call foilies, as well as singed bottoms, basically all that you'd need to free base cocaine, which essentially turns cocaine into crack. Uh there was uh out cigarettes, there was medication, all that was on the table. So the police were able to see that. Uh, in addition, John had grabbed uh Dr. Pena's phone because his phone did not have reception out there. So he'd actually used Dr. Pena's phone to contact the police and have them come out. How did the brother-in-law find out about it so quickly?

SPEAKER_02:

That's the thing.

SPEAKER_04:

Well, his family, he lived on the same street. So everybody was on this street in Asherton. Asherton's known as the Chetho. Uh that's what everybody calls it out there. And everybody knows everybody. And we would come to later find out how everybody, in fact, knew everybody.

SPEAKER_03:

And knew a lot of what was going on.

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah, yeah. And so basically he got out there and he's like, What am I going to tell my mother? Dr. Pena's mother lived up the street. She came out, I believe his sister did as well. So there was, I mean, yeah, they were all there. And the whole time John is in the backseat, cooperative, you could tell that he had ingested some form of drug just based on how he was carrying himself. They end up taking him to the police station where they actually strip him of his clothes and they put him in what most of us call suicide smock, uh, which is, you know, very funny. It's an odd looking coat if you don't know what it is. And the Texas Ranger, who was a uh later on basically called to it, whose name is a Ranger Baldis, uh, who also was from the Chetto, uh, we would later find out. Uh from the same little town of Ashterton, where where Carlos Pena had lived and had been, I believe, most of his life. They bring him in and they sit John down. Now you remember John's 18. He's barely 18, if memory serves. And he's sitting there, and you know, he gets questioned by him and two other officers, the Ranger and two other officers, and doesn't spare a detail, tells them everything. And every detail he gives matches completely with what he had said in the back of the car, what he had said on 911. His story never deviated. And what he Because it's not a story. It's exactly right. And so what ended up happening was is after all of that, they ended up charging him with murder. And so that's how he picked up a murder charge.

SPEAKER_03:

Despite him saying, hey, that this guy was abusing me.

SPEAKER_04:

Yes, and that on that particular night, and he he told them that basically Carlos Peña was his counselor.

SPEAKER_03:

He was well, let's talk a little bit about that. Um, so how does this uh counselor and and you know, my recollection is uh Carlos Peña was the migrant counselor at the school. So he he had these students that he worked with that were kind of part of a what we might call a vulnerable population. Absolutely. So how how does he come to end up with students at his house?

SPEAKER_04:

Okay, well, and that kind of goes to a pattern that we would establish later. But I can say that with John's case, and it wasn't unusual, and anybody who works in academia will usually tell you you're not supposed to text or call on uh students on an individual basis. It's a no-no. And he'd actually been reprimanded for that before. But when on their cell phones, yeah, yeah. And what he would do is he would, and there was clear actual in the school district itself, it in clear language, you don't do this. And but what would happen is that Carlos Peña, to go with what you were talking about vulnerable population, he'd only been a migrant counselor there for about a year. Before that, he was teaching honors classes, and we talk about that. But what ended up happening was is that he would be basically catering to students who were often impoverished, uh, come from migrant families. Um, you know, and and John had been born in out there in Asherton, or I'm sorry, in uh Cariso Springs. So, but his family that he could uh there was enough there to establish that him being a migrant student. And so he would try to basically play the part of, I want to help you get into college. Now, Dr. Pena had a number of degrees from higher education, and so he liked to play that part, like I'm a doctor, you know, I know more than everybody, and he carried himself to be that type of big guy who could help you do things.

SPEAKER_03:

Certainly somebody who, if you're uh a student who hopes to get to college, you know, this might be a guy that you might even admire. Absolutely. Because he he has, I imagine he had a doctorate if they're referring to him as a doctor. Absolutely. And so he's in that community, and uh, you know, I'm sure people are looking up to him and saying, hey, that this guy may be able to help you get into college.

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah. And I mean, it made the news at the time, but I don't remember if we ever actually took note of it when it was happening. It wasn't until uh his family showed up in my office that I started to pay attention. And so it wasn't uh too long after that that his family came to my office. And he has just, I'll put this out there, he's an incredible family, sure. Just an amazing support network.

SPEAKER_03:

Well, and and so, you know, kind of getting back to how uh this counselor would get the the student over to his house, um he would give him a reason to come over.

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah, so the way that it would start off, the pattern that we would later see is hey, I want to help you get into college, I want to help you get scholarships, I'm the guy that can do it, I'm the guy that knows things. And then after a while, those text messages would later turn into, hey, how would you like to make some extra money coming over to my man cave or something like that is how he would refer to it, and say, and help me clean, I'll pay you$10 an hour, which to the to a lot of those kids, that was a ton of money. And so, you know, he would say, Why don't you come over and do that? A lot of kids were like, uh-uh-uh. And what would happen is if you said no long enough, he'd go to your parents and he would say, Hey, I'm trying to help your kid, you know, will you, you know, help me out by having him come to my house? And then once they'd get over to the house, that's when it really escalated. And it didn't take long for it to happen.

SPEAKER_03:

And and Scott, I mean, you've worked a lot in crimes against children. Uh, I think, you know, some of what is being described here you you might call grooming.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, it's grooming, no, no, no doubt. Uh, and and so and if he's got a position of authority, so he can groom with impudence. I mean, and nobody's checking him on any of this stuff. Right. And and I mean, you talk about vulnerable community. I'm sure some of these kids weren't here legally, and he probably pulled that card here again, too.

SPEAKER_03:

And and so, you know, the the sexual abuse, did that start at the very first visit?

SPEAKER_04:

Or it well, along with patterns of grooming, he felt his way along. And the fortunate thing for John's defense was he did it, you know, that sense of immunity that he had for so long really empowered him to make incredibly foolish mistakes that we were able to later uh to push put a light on. And that that really helped because he'd stayed, I mean, as time it went by, you would see that he'd gotten away with so much. He became reckless, he became incredibly reckless. So, whenever you know, John came into my office for the first time and I met this kid, you know. I mean, we've we've all tried our fair share of murders, and you and I have tried a number of them together. You know, this was one of those that came in and it's it was like this is no simple matter. This is something that's so much deeper, and it became much very purposeful for I think both of us. And so whenever I spoke to John for the first time, you know, we're all fathers. And it's whenever you talk talk to a kid like this, I think most of us would say, I was like, I'd be lucky if my kid turned out like that, you know.

SPEAKER_03:

And this was a good student.

SPEAKER_04:

Oh, fantastic. So John was he was 18 years old. He was gonna be, he he gotten a scholarship by the time I talked to him. Um, so I believe Southwest Texas Junior College. He had two years of college credits under his belt already. He was working three jobs. Uh, he was working at uh Migalitos, the restaurant that we spent a lot of time in uh during trial. He was uh working as a janitor in the high school so that he could, you know, help his status. He was also selling concessions at any sports games that he wasn't actually playing, because he was also an athlete who was playing a number of sports. Um, you know, and he had, like I said, an amazing family. He had a great mother, uh Lisa, who we still talk today, uh, stepfather David, um, you know, his his father William, just all these people were uh were just such a it was an amazing family dynamic. And when you looked at John and you talked to him, later on they would try to say, Oh, he's no angel. Well, maybe not, but he was a fan, he's a fantastic kid. He's a kid. And when you look at him and you listen to his story, you're like, I have to protect this kid. I mean, we're talking you're talking to two former sexual assault prosecutors. I mean, we see somebody like that, even though we're on the defense side, your natural inclination is I've got to protect this kid. And it's uh, it's almost I don't know if you I don't know what you call it, but it's uh almost a sickness in you to where you're just like, I'll I'll die trying, you know.

SPEAKER_03:

And then he's charged with murder in this community. Yes, and uh that they it actually ended up in a trial for murder because that case never went away. No, uh, it played out over the course of what was it, five years?

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah, yeah. And I mean, when we finally heard John's story for the first time, I forget if you were there or not when we we heard the story, but it was one of those where there were a lot of details that came to light because we didn't have the police reports and the discovery and the 911s. They didn't give that to us for a year. So we're just getting his side of the story, but you believed him. I mean, whenever you're you're listening to him, you're like, this is this is true.

SPEAKER_03:

And and and and his account, you know, goes to the pattern of kind of grooming Scott because the first time he goes over there, uh, he's you know going over there to help clean, and he's offered uh beer and he's offered cocaine.

SPEAKER_04:

And this high school counselor having never tried cocaine before, you know, he tried alcohol, he tried, you know, what he'd been a high school student. Yeah, but this guy is introducing him to cocaine for the first time and using his during the first visit.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah, and that's not when the assault occurred it built up from there. But we're coming up on a break, and so when we get back, we're gonna get into more details on this very fascinating case.

SPEAKER_01:

The attorneys of BRIC Criminal Defense have helped over 5,000 clients move on with their lives. When an arrest or accusation turns your life upside down, we have the knowledge, experience, and integrity to get your life back on track. Traditional legal ethics, modern legal tactics, the best defense possible to get you through the criminal justice system. Search Brick Criminal Defense to see our reviews and find out why so many of our clients have trusted us to fight for them. Brit Criminal Defense, helping our clients move on with their lives.

SPEAKER_03:

So you have this young man who's charged with the murder, and he's coming in and he's kind of given you his account of it. Uh, do you mind sharing that account?

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah. So, John uh essentially, I think it was towards the end of 2018. Uh, you know, like I said, he was working these three jobs, and it's time for him to start really concentrating on trying to get scholarships in the college. Now, his mom, Lisa, she worked at the school, she worked at the office. Um, you know, and really the only thing she knew about Dr. Pena was he was a very accomplished man because that's how he carried himself around. And but he was a little weird. Like whenever John was asked, talked about, he's like, Yeah, we just know he was kind of weird, but he was an important man. And so, you know, Pena starts getting John's, he gets his phone and he starts texting him. And in the beginning, it's regular text like, Hey, I'm just trying to help you. I know how to do these things. And John is very grateful and he gladly accepts it. And it's not very long before this this guy starts saying, Hey, you know, do you need any money? And he's like, Well, I got a job and I do really well. And as the texts start getting a little more progressive and more, they start increasing in ratio. So where it's not just one text a week, it's like three a day. And John it kind of lets him know, like, well, yeah, I'll help you at some point in time, but you can see he's pushing him away. We have these texts, so we know. And so it gets a little bit more uh aggressive until and John is doing a skillful job because anybody who knows John knows that he's he's the nicest guy when it says thanks, but no thanks.

SPEAKER_03:

And you have this authority figure at school kind of pressuring you. Yeah, like, hey, I want you to come over and help me out.

SPEAKER_04:

I think he does this for like a month or two before eventually he goes to Lisa, John's mom, and essentially puts the pressure on her and says, Hey, I'm trying to, I'm trying to do, you know, help your son here, you know, have him come over to my house and because he's saying, like, I'll give you$10 an hour. And Lisa being like, she is the the the mom who wants her son to do great things. And so she tell goes to John and says, John, Michael, you get over there and you you help him.

SPEAKER_03:

This is the counselor. He's helping you get into college.

SPEAKER_04:

Well, what are you doing? And so John, not without even wasting a beat, basically texts, say, I can be over there tomorrow or the next day. And so that's when things start to really get nuts with the text messages, because then Pena, as we would later find out, was just relentless. He was texting him.

SPEAKER_03:

Um, I mean, if it wouldn't surprise me if you said the day he said he would go over there, he texted 50 times and said, you know, like I think it it was uh we found out, you know, as we were prepping for trial, that the after that first visit John made to the house, Pena texted him like 500 times before the next visit.

SPEAKER_04:

It was at one after the first time he went over there that night.

SPEAKER_03:

He because the first time he goes over there, nothing the first time he goes over there, there's nothing sexual that happens. Well when the grooming kind of starts.

SPEAKER_04:

It starts. Well, it the grooming starts, but the overt um joking was was one of the things. Classic grooming. So essentially what he because he's feeling it along. And so when John goes over there for the first time, he brings trash bags, he buys them from Dollar Tree and brings them over there. He's like, I'm going over here to clean. And in his mind, he's got Pena's house built up. And by the time he gets to this house and he sees what it is, I mean, it looks like it looks like a crack house, is what it looks like. And when he goes in, he's freaking out. And when he does go in, also he notices Dr. Pena locking the doors behind him. And one of those doors is lockable only by key. So it's like a double. He locks it and double locked. You lock it from the inside. The only thing you can get out is breaking out or with a key. So as he's doing this, Carlos Pena is following John around and basically talking sexually to him, uh, asking him about you know certain things that are just very personal, uh, as a genitalia, and then uh starts trying to coax him to do uh cocaine. Now, before John ever got there, one of the things that Pena liked to say was what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas. He would tell him, like, hey, whatever you see at my house, I don't want anybody to know about, I don't want anybody to talk about. And he makes John promise multiple times that, yeah, I promise I won't, I won't do that. Is that on text? It's on text. And so whenever John gets to the house and uh, you know, he starts cleaning Pena's following him around. And after about four or five hours, because John timed it, and I think he did this on purpose so that he could have a reason to leave, was he had to go to Miguelitos to work his shift after that. And so Pena, you know, after hours of him like, and there's one point where Pena's literally on his bed on his stomach watching John clean. He just watched him. And so whenever John goes to work that night, we counted. Pena was trying to texted him 97 times between like 5 p.m. and like 10 15, all trying to get him to say he's sick, to come back. I'll pay you extra, I'll pay you more.

SPEAKER_03:

This is a high school guidance counselor texting a student.

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah, and so he says that, and John is like skillfully saying no, no, no, no. But at this point in time, you have the dynamic that we didn't get to see very much, where you have male on male grooming in a county where it's like it's I mean, in any situation, male on male, they're not gonna know what to do a lot of times. They're not gonna know what to say. And so you've got John in this position where he's like, I don't know what to do. And so that next day he he's you know coaxed into going out there again for a second time. That second time, now that John, because he he the way he got John to do cocaine was basically telling him, I trust you, you trust me. Come on, let's and John would notice that he was more resilient to the cocaine than Pena was. And when Pena would be doing cocaine, John was relieved. And I had to ask him, like, why would you be relieved? And he's like, Because whenever he would do that, he would leave me alone. And so that was almost like it kept his hands in his mouth and his body busy. So that second time goes over and it it it escalates. And now Pena, and this is the way like Pena got reckless, is he would be on his phone on the notes app and he would type out what it is that he wanted to see happen, and then he would hand it to John and have John text back. And John would text, like, hey, that's just for the ladies, or I'm only into the girls. He would say no, the way that John could only feel like he could say no to a migrant counselor. It's like, so he would say, No, I'm I'm not into that. I I know that you are, and he would even say, It's like, I appreciate that you are, I don't judge you, uh, but I'm I'm just about the ladies.

SPEAKER_02:

So I I take it that everybody in the school knew that the the the counselor was gay.

SPEAKER_04:

They no, no, as a matter of fact, uh he had been married. Uh he'd uh there was there was discussion, but really no, they didn't. And so I mean, there were his people that worked next to him that actually were arguing to law enforcement later on, like he's completely heterosexual, and because that was that was the ruse that he was trying to perpetrate for so long or perpetuate. So, you know, this the the cocaine that first time, then the second time he would try to do that again, have him smoke cocaine, because I think he thought that that might loosen him up and have him more pliant. Um, and so it was after that, because it was one day after the other of memory serves that it happened. And then there was a period where John was just trying to avoid him. And John would go to great lengths to try to avoid him because he could see this man getting more aggressive.

SPEAKER_03:

And in the meantime, these text messages are still coming in.

SPEAKER_04:

Oh, they're non-stop. And so, like every single day he's texting, texting, texting. And if here's the thing, if like what you need to understand is it wasn't like these were text messages that had substance, it would be like, Sir, can you come over tonight? Sir, sir, can you hear me? What's going on? Oh, I see how it is. Okay. And it wouldn't just stop because this guy was high as a kite for so many hours of the day, you'd wonder, it's like, when do you sleep? And it would go relentlessly day and night. And so, and you know, meanwhile, John's looking at this like, I don't know what to do with this. Now, later on, we would find out he wasn't the by far the only one. But what would end up happening is that uh John would just try to say, I'm sorry, sir, I'm just you know, I've got things that I've got to do, or I've got to go to a game, I've got to work. So by the third time, unfortunately, um, he went to the mom again. So he goes to mom again and says, Hey, I'm still trying to get your son help. Can he come over? And Lisa, who knew nothing about this stuff, you know, um, said, Yeah, okay. So he goes over a third time. And on the third time, it was a little bit more substantial because on this particular time, he said, I want, you know, um, he he basically, as John was trying to leave after several hours, he said, Um, you know, I want I want you to clean with your pants, your shorts down. So he got to where it's like, you're not gonna leave until you know, you gotta put your shorts down around your ankles. And he would have John clean like this. And then it got to the point where the only way he would let him leave that night, because he was getting texts from his mom, like, where you at? And he's like, the only way he could leave is if you actually show it to me. And so John, who at the time was like, Okay, well, that's if that's all I gotta do to do it, let's just do it and get it over with.

SPEAKER_03:

Keep in mind, you know, he's in this this room or this man cave with the double locked doors. The guy's six foot five and two fifty and have an 18-year-old kid.

SPEAKER_04:

Yes, yes. And and out there where you desperately need academia if you ever hope to do anything, you know, of an educ with education in your life. So he was able to leave that night after doing that. And when he left, he said to himself, I don't ever want to do this, I can't go back, I can't do it. Right. And so he basically swore to himself, I'm not gonna go back. So, you know, however many much time had passed, Pena's still not stopping, you know. And so on one day, one evening, he'd gotten a call like, Will you, you know, will you come over? Can you come over uh tomorrow? He's like, doesn't answer. That next morning, he uh basically tries to avoid Pena and he ends up working in the cafeteries, working the cafeteries, cleaning, doing his janitorial. Yeah, the ladies who worked at the in the cafeteria just adored him. Uh everybody adored him, you know, and so uh, but he said, you know what, I'm gonna go see my mom because I know my mom is eating lunch in the you know, the the teacher's lounge. So he goes in there, and as he goes in there, he sees his mom at the end sitting in chair, and as he walks through, Pena's right next to her. And he sees Pena and he's like, his heart sinks because he doesn't know what to do. And Pena brings up in front of uh, you know, Lisa, like, yeah, I'm trying to get your son to come over here, but he's not responding. And she says, You're gonna go over there and you're gonna help him tonight. And so she told him to do it, and he's like, Okay, so you know, you do what your mom tells you out there.

SPEAKER_02:

And so so it's what he just didn't feel comfortable telling his mom the what the background?

SPEAKER_04:

No, he didn't feel talking. I mean, and other kids that he knew who knew Pena and actually knew more about Pena than they let on would really only tell him he's just weird.

SPEAKER_03:

And so, but that evening when he went over there, you gotta remember there there's this underlying kind of machismo thing in you know, uh a lot of communities.

SPEAKER_02:

And so you you don't really talk about I can see why your your friends wouldn't say it, but but I you know if if he had brought it up to his mother, his mother wouldn't have nagged it.

SPEAKER_04:

Well, and I don't I don't think, and I mean, uh well, and and his stepdad David, who outstanding guy, he was a football coach at the time out there as well. So he was a football coach out out there at uh Cadizo Springs High School. And so he So he goes his fourth time. And this was this was the last time. And so the fourth time he gets there, and Pena, you gotta realize this guy's within, I think, weeks of uh of weeks, if not a couple of months, from graduating. And Pena knows as soon as this guy walks the stage, he's lost his chance. So he's looking at this like, I gotta make a move. And so he is doubling down on the cocaine, he is doubling down on the alcohol, he is hitting it hard that night. And John is trying to keep his pace. Eventually it gets to the point where John starts, the guy is aggressively trying to say, Let me touch it, let me do that. He's like, Oh, it's just for the ladies. And Pena's trying harder. And and John essentially says, like, maybe if I have a little bit more of the white stuff. And Pena's like, oh, okay. And he's doing it. And John, meanwhile, is thinking he's like, I if I can outlast this guy, then run out the clock. Then I can run out the clock and I can get out of here. And Pena is just going at it like a nut job. Uh, and eventually it gets to the point where Lisa is texting John and she knows that he doesn't have reception, so she texts Pena and says, Where is my son? Is he out there? And so that's at the point where John's like, Okay, I think I can finally leave. And at that point in time, uh, Pena says, Now you're not going anywhere until you show it to me again. And so at that point in time, John is like, okay, this worked last time, maybe it'll work this time. And so what he does is he pulls down his underwear just enough for Pena to see. And it's at that point in time, Pena who's sitting down and John who's standing up a matter of just a couple of feet from him, Pena reaches over and grabs his his bare exposed genitals and begins to lean forward. And it's at that moment in time that John essentially kind of, I wouldn't say black out, because he he he basically, yeah, kind of snaps. He punches Carlos Peña in the head and it doesn't do anything. Pena basically looks at him, and John would say is like his eyes were so red, I was scared to death. And then he punches him again with his left with his left, I believe. And who knows how many times he punched him, but this guy didn't let go. He's a big guy. He's a huge guy. And on top of that, the amount of cocaine we would later find in his system definitely played a part, uh, according to their own medical examiner. So he goes, Pena goes down to the ground, and the first thing he does is he grips the hold of John's ankle. Now, as I said before, John is cleaning with his shorts around his ankle. So not only is he grabbing his ankle, he's grabbing his shorts, and he's keeping him from being able to go anywhere. John is freaking out, so he reaches down and he grabs the knife that his girlfriend had bought for him with his name on it, had a belt cutter that he carried to, you know, and John extends it and begins stabbing him in the throat.

SPEAKER_03:

And that's step right there. That goes to the charge of murder. But um, in the next episode, uh, we're going to continue discussing this case, and we're going to find out that during your investigation, you found out that John was by far not the only one that was being groomed by this this. This counselor. Correct.

SPEAKER_02:

Cliffhanger. We're leaving the audience.

SPEAKER_03:

There you go. There you go. So uh that's all for today. Uh please watch the next episode.

SPEAKER_00:

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